There were a few incidents of violence at or nearby occupations yesterday, but, unlike previous incidents, the police did not provoke the violence. Yesterday, a 35-year old veteran shot himself at Occupy Burlington.
A statement posted by Occupy Burlington (also referred to as Occupy Vermont) reads:
Today, November 10th at 2pm, Josh, a valued member of Occupy Burlington and the houseless community, took his own life at the encampment. We want to take this moment to offer our thoughts and condolences to Josh’s family, and to the members of the Occupy community who got to know Josh over the last two weeks…
…From the first day of the encampment, we have welcomed all members of the community by providing anyone in need with food, shelter, and social support. Despite our best efforts to provide care and support to all members of the community, occupations are not equipped with the infrastructure and resources needed to care for the most vulnerable members of our community. The lack of resources to care for those in need was brought to the attention of Burlington city leaders. Unfortunately, our plea for assistance was not heeded in time to help Josh.
This tragedy draws attention to the gross inequalities within our system. We mourn the loss of a great friend tonight, while discovering an ever-deeper resolve to stand with our most vulnerable citizens. The failure to provide citizens with adequate and accessible physical and mental healthcare is one of the many issues this movement is fighting for.
Also, a man was shot at 14th and Broadway last night at Occupy Oakland. The occupation posted a statement:
A man was shot and killed outside of Tully’s just before 5pm this evening. Occupy Oakland medics were the first on the scene to try and assist the victim. Others formed a circle around the victim to prevent gawkers and media people from interfering with emergency procedures. Oakland police now have the area marked off with yellow tape. Our condolences and greatest sympathies go out to the man’s family and friends.
Occupy Oakland is concerned that this shooting will be used to force occupiers to disperse from Frank Ogawa Plaza (what they have renamed Oscar Grant Park). The concern is valid as Mayor Jean Quan has asked the occupation to pack up and go home. And, after last night, City Council President Larry Reid says, “I think it puts us in a position of having to look at this problem in a more comprehensive manner,” which is coded language for this may justify shutting down the occupation.
In Vermont, Deputy Chief Andy Higbee said something similar. The suicide of a veteran with mental health problems, according to Higbee, raises “questions about whether the protest should be allowed to continue.”
Each of these incidents appear to be incidents that would have happened whether there were occupations or not. Sadly, Josh would have probably taken his life if Occupy Burlington never had setup a camp. He just would have done it somewhere else. And, people would have been fighting nearby Frank Ogawa Plaza if Occupy Oakland had no camp. But, for those in government who want to see this movement go away, they have no problem with trying to connect the two.
At Occupy Burlington, Josh possibly lived a few days longer because he found some people who were willing to listen. Medics were on the scene at Occupy Oakland to call for an ambulance and help protect the area from “gawkers.” They could have done much more if the city had fixed the lights, which were off. [The city claims the plaza has a faulty circuit breaker that Occupy Oakland has not allowed them to fix.]
The reality is that city governments, especially city governments with sizable metro areas, will stop at nothing to obstruct and prevent occupations from becoming fixtures in the city. Occupations have to stay ahead of the propaganda and anticipate instances, where officials are most definitely going to spin something to discredit or undermine the occupation.
Finally, today on Veterans Day, as we ponder and discuss what veterans and issues of war and peace might mean to the Occupy movement, let us all at the very least listen with empathy to veterans like Josh. Let us understand that they have served in a military that the US government has populated with underclass people who are desperate for a future of employment and stability. They have joined with the hope of being able to serve a few years and then go to college and start a family. In many cases they have become saddled with debt and returned home carrying the baggage that one carries after being deployed in war. They have been denied care, their families have been unsure of how to handle them and a record number have committed suicide.
One stark example: A Pittsburgh man killed his family—his wife and her parents—and then committed suicide. He posted a suicide note to Facebook. He shot them and himself in his foreclosed home. According to the San Francisco Chronicle, ”The couple filed for bankruptcy protection in 2009, saying they owed $552,000 for their home, valued at $240,000, court records show. At the time, Aube worked as an accounts manager at a Santa Clara building maintenance company, and his wife worked in technical support at a Richmond construction firm. The couple’s home was in foreclosure, and a notice of default for the four-bedroom residence was issued in July.” This man, whom The Nation‘s Greg Mitchell notes was a Marine veteran.
In the effort to rebuild American society so it is more equitable and fair, they must be brought into the movement. That does not mean compromising is required. War crimes, torture, their participation in the killing of hundreds of thousands of civilians and other atrocities can still be confronted by those in the movement, who want to speak out about such atrocities at occupations. But the veterans must be offered an opportunity to heal and even atone for whatever they are struggling to confront internally.
Firedoglake’s premier blog continues now. Here is a Twitter list to follow for the latest updates on the movement. All times are ET.
11:55 PM At 9:00 pm, a plainclothes man carried out another seizure of an OWS generator. The police claim he was a Fire Marshal.
11:46 PM Occupy Central Park: Here is the livestream of occupiers trying to take over Central Park. They are still there. The plan is to have a prayer circle. Not sure where this is going. There is no real plan to have an encampment. The organizers want to engage in civil disobedience and hold the park throughout the night.
11:41 PM This is a copy of the eviction notice handed to Occupy Oakland. Cops are saying it isn’t an “eviction notice.” It just is a “notice of violations and demand to end violations.” But, one of those violations is lodging in Frank Ogawa Plaza. That quite clearly calls for decamping. It is, in effect, an eviction notice.
11:38 PM Scott Olsen is now out of the hospital.
11:31 PM

Also, here is the link for donating to the STL Occupy bail fund. People are planning on disobeying the order to disperse if police enforce the eviction order.
11:22 PM Occupy St. Louis is facing eviction now. Mayor Francis Slay was for an eviction before he was against it and then he decided he was going to go ahead and get rid of them after all except he wasn’t going to do it at 3:30 pm like he had planned. He was going to wait until 10:30 pm to force them out of Kiener Plaza.
Here’s the scene right now. There are many people down there who have come to show their support and are not permanent occupiers:

11:21 PM Yesterday, the General Assembly passed a resolution that funds OWS Ambassadors who will travel to Egypt to help Egyptians monitor the November 28 Parliamentary Elections. Resolution here.
10:58 PM Much late night activity going on. First, a few remarks on Occupy Wall Street
1. The space has been wholly transformed. Military tents and personal tents are now up. This may not be news, but it struck me when I walked up on the occupation. The tents make it much more difficult for people to walk through the park and meet occupiers.
2. I tried to go to the Spokes Council tonight (which @LibertySqGA is still tweeting right now). I was unable to get in because the space Trinity Church donated for them to use was nearly over capacity. They needed to get Working Group members into the space. I left and went back to Liberty Park where a General Assembly was happening. There was not supposed to be one. There was a Spokes Council event tonight. But, a group held a General Assembly because the “1% of Liberty Park.”
I was handed a small leaflet that read: “Down with the 1% of Liberty Plaza. Down with financiers. Down with closed facilitation. Down with representation. Down with bureaucracy.” It indicated a General Assembly would be at 7 pm with an “open agenda” and “open facilitation.”
3. The orange sculpture down in Liberty Square has barricades around it. I found out some people climbed the structure and the police were freaked out. They now have a police officer patrolling it like they have officers patrolling the bull.
5:58 PM A few hours ago, Mayor Slay of St. Louis tweeted that based on reports things were essentially improving in Kiener Plaza. He decided not to have the city move in to evict the occupation today. As far as I know, they are still there. That is good because it was one of the more memorable occupations I visited on my Midwest tour of occupations.
5:55 PM Hip hop artist Boots Riley deconstructs the propaganda being spread by Oakland mayor Jean Quan, other city officials and the media
5:54 PM Here is video I recorded of Joan Baez. This is the full set she played – 3 songs, including “Joe Hill.”
11:37 AM Live in New York or nearby? Come meet me at the corner of Broadway & Liberty in Liberty Square at 6 pm tonight. I will be there after all the afternoon Occupy Wall Street action. Hope to meet some fine FDL members and talk about what I have been seeing at occupations I have visited.
11:36 AM Eloquent and very similar to what I wrote in the intro to the live blog. Here is Allison Kilkenny on the possibility of shootings or suicides being used to justify shutting down occupations.
11:25 AM Patrick Bruner, who is on the media working group for Occupy Wall Street, talked about the biggest obstacle OWS has to overcome last night on the panel organized by The Nation at The New School
11:06 AM Introducing The People’s Firehouse at Occupy Wall Street
10:18 AM A somewhat juvenile report from Los Angeles Times on incident involving occupiers in San Diego being detained on buses and forced to “poo” and “pee.” (Writer is probably proud of himself for coming up with “Occupoopy.”) Story features a photo of a woman holding a sign that says, “My Ass Hurts.” Okay…
10:14 AM Navy veteran Shake Anderson at Occupy Oakland on the murder last night.
10:11 AM Adbusters with a post on Occupy not becoming ritualistic. Perhaps, cynically says Occupy is “becoming corpuscular”:
After saturating politics at the city scale, #OCCUPY is splintering downward, becoming corpuscular. Encampments are emerging that target niche communities and causes, a welcome development. There is, for example, Occupy The Boiler Room, an encampment to block gentrification in Harlem. And perhaps the most significant new development is the move onto university campuses with Wednesday’s launch of both #OCCUPYHARVARD and UC Berkeley’s #OCCUPYCAL.
10:09 AM Musician Joseph Arthur will be at the Veterans Day concert at 1 pm. Arthur is known for singing “In the Sun.”
10:01 AM Full video of Chris Hedges, Cornel West and others at trial – The People vs. Goldman Sachs
9:28 AM Musician Joan Baez will be at a Veterans Day concert today at 1 pm. It will have sound amplification and is a permitted event. There will be other artists who play music as well.
9:26 AM Somber and dark diary at Daily Kos on veterans in crisis.
9:12 AM At least part of the park area where Occupy Burlington was camping is closed after veteran commits suicide. City cites “safety concerns.” Unclear if occupiers have left scene. Unclear if all of the park is closed or if just part is cordoned off.
8:58 AM Blog one can follow for the latest on the march of occupiers from Occupy Wall Street to DC.
8:50 AM Powerful drawing for veteran Scott Olsen injured at Occupy Oakland
8:47 AM An occupier with Occupy Vancouver explains why the occupation should continue.
8:40 AM Rita Nakashima, who has done some work in the Interfaith Tent, writes about why she knew nobody with Occupy Oakland was responsible for the shooting.
8:30 AM Occupy Oakland should “voluntarily leave,” says Mayor Quan



219 Comments

Horace Boothroyd II, Daily Kos: Occupy Portland:Arrest Made in Molotov Cocktail Incident+
The diary contains links to portlandonline.com and oregonlive.com.
thanks kevin.
I had an idea which I posted on another thread. i was thinking we could take stores posted here and get them as trending tweets by everyone using twitter to do this including people at occupy. for example the story posted on SEC salp on writs fine to citi. could post as “govt let’s bank off the hook again” and many other such stories. I think if we could get these stories to “trend” we could break though the dumbed down media reporting.
Everything will be blamed on Occupy by the PTB.
They are desperately trying to figure out what to do about it. If they let it alone it will be peaceful, it will get no news coverage, but then continue for a long long time, and if they try to break it up, the police are violent and then it gets on the news and then it gets publicity.
Catch-22 working against PTB for a change.
Great idea mswinkle. We need to go around the status quo in every way so we create new social structures. It is happening.
Rick Bookstaber, Economonitor: Class Warfare and Revolution (Circa 1850)
…
Struck by this in Ms. Nakashima’s account:
“My friends with the Interfaith Tent told me that after the police came and did an investigation, the occupiers created an altar with candles where the slain man had lain. We began Wednesday night to hold late night candlelight vigils to protect the camp from evacuation by doing a prayer walk around its entire perimeter. The vigil group held a short service with silence at the altar for the victim. No one knew him, but the group nonetheless grieved that he was dead.”
Occupy is a microcosm of the larger world in which death plays an inevitable part. Deal with it.
Thanks Kevin.
PTB are too smart by half they started what goes around and now it’s coming back around and they’re scared.
x2 Go Kevin and Firedoglake!
The marine vet killing himself and his family in his foreclosed home feels a lot like a self-immolation a la Tunisia.
Not scared enough yet.
Terrible economy plus despair equals tragedy.
Great link, including his earlier post. Thanks.
But there’s ELLAS, Italia, Ireland, and Iberia yet to sort out. And the bankers are still singing “Austerity Forever”.
Empire makes you stupid.
I’m listening to Flynt Leverett interview on another window, which is why my replies are so short. http://antiwar.com/radio/2011/11/10/flynt-leverett-6/ I’m sorry I can’t multitask well enough to both listen to something of high quality & engage in another conversation at the same time.
Flynt Leverett is a national treasure.
Yes, and it pisses me off that veteran of a fabricated war came home to be forced into bankruptcy and foreclosed upon because of the crimes of wealthy for and by whom he was sent to war to serve.
The American twist to the story is that the marine chose to take the life of his wife and her parents as well.
If OWS is able to manage constructive negotiation with the Palace Guard, their lack of scaredness will change quickly.
I’m still in the watching & evaluating mode. I like what I see so far, but it’s hard to tell where it will go.
“The suicide of a veteran with mental health problems, according to Higbee, raises “questions about whether the protest should be allowed to continue.”
I read somewhere this week that a veteran commits suicide every 80 minutes in this country. Can’t see how that has anything to do with OWS et. al.
There is a lot of diversity across the local manifestations of Occupy Wall Street. Some have found their legs and are moving into some interesting areas of action. Occupy Atlanta has essentially become additional volunteer staff at a homeless shelter, and their presence and visibility is preventing the gentrification of the site into expensive commercial real estate. In addition, they are obstructing and eviction (of a DeKalb County law enforcement officer) from a suburban house in Gwinnett County.
Occupy New Haven is going to be occupying an old factory building and starting a number of enterprises there, starting with a “free store”.
Occupy Columbia (SC) has provided protesters for the campaigns of several other local groups. One opposed a downtown Walmart public/private project across from the state capitol, which they framed as protecting small downtown businesses. Another was exposing the plans the nuclear industry has for turning South Carolina into a nuclear waste processing center, as well as the shaky condition of some of the older reactors in South Carolina.
Occupy Nashville has been going after utility rate hikes, as has Occupy Louisville.
Bank Transfer Day was a project of almost every Occupy group in the South and drew favorable press.
It will continue to be hard to tell where it will go because of the large (and still growing) number of local groups and because of the diversity in the composition of those groups.
Except for the Serbian organizers who undoubtedly have CIA backing, there is not yet any apparent outside group coordinating events here in the US. So far it seems mainly grassroots, but it is hard to say for sure. It has the potential to go in many different directions, not all non-violent. The status quo is in for a change, but it is impossible to predict what that change will be. All we can hope for is that cooler minds prevail.
That’s a nice summary. Thanks very much.
I’ve seen one post that claimed there was some nefarious shadowy PTB that were behind the organization of Occupy movement, but I have yet to come across a second ref to that.
I have no doubt the CIA is trying to figure out a way of coopting the movement wherever it can.
The homeless woman I talked to at OWS on Wednesday told me that if you ask an undercover NYC cop whether he is police, he must identify himself as such, iow he is not supposed to lie. Whether they do or not remains an open Q.
She claimed to have picked up a lot of street knowledge in her 2 years of homelessness, and she seemed smart & articulate so I was inclined to take her word.
11.11.11 11:11:11
It’s related in that a veteran’s suicide is a symptom of the systemic problems around which OWS has organized.
The corporate media, sadly, will report that a suicide is a result of #occupy rather than a result of the total collapse of the social contract that protects and supports citizens. OWS wants the rebirth of that social contract.
Missed it by a minute!
I am still surprised and angered by the behavior of some of the police across the country. I donate to 3 county police groups who do good things for children and families of slain officers. I now don’t feel the same about them and am not sure what to do in the future.
Tina Dupuy, The Atlantic: At Occupy Camps, Veterans Bring the Wars Home
If you had lived in NYC as long as I did, you wouldn’t have been so naive. Some (a minority to be sure) are routinely & gratuitously brutal. The big problem is the blue line of protecting them from any kind of accountability; thereby the problem becomes a majority one.
The Burlington, Vermont city police said on the radio that they are looking to see if they can use the veteran’s suicide as an excuse to evict the Occupy Burlington assembly.
Dustin Woolridge, The News-Virginian: Occupy movement shifts to Staunton
The CIA goes with the flow. The folks in Langley are certainly busy these days working to figure out how to exploit OWS for the benefit of those it serves — the inner circle of the 1%.
Given the weed-unfriendly guidelines of OWS encampments, I would imagine being an undercover cop is an extremely tedious assignment.
Undercover NYC police are required by law to declare their status at political events. I have gone to several and at the top of the meeting the facilitators ask if there are any undercover police present and to identify themselves in accordance with the law. None of them ever do!
I did spot a ‘smoker’ at OWS on Wednesday.
Why am I not surprised.
LOL. Who’s gonna arrest them for disobeying the law?
No doubt suffering from a migraine. Occupy Oakland said they weren’t going to stop folks from taking their medicine. *heh*
My suggestion was to introduce yourself by your name to the people around you, shake their hand, and ask them personally if they are undercover from any agency, then snap their picture with your cell phone.
Who knows, your doc of their lie might come in useful at some point in the future & making it up close & personal might serve as a bit of a chilling factor on that kind of activity.
Perhaps I dream.
But the homeless woman liked the idea.
That ought to be a standard question at GA’s, as the GA’s are often filmed. Later, when the provocateaurs are identified and linked to law enforcement, they can be shown not to have identified themselves when asked.
No doubt.
One day a month should be dedicated as light-up day. What are they going to do, bust everybody? I was at Woodstock where a half million lit up. Not a single one was busted.
MJ is not one of my issues. I don’t do it. Liquor is my vice of choice.
Did you check out the website I linked earlier?
MJ is key to the revolution. It opens up minds that are confined.
One of the problems OWS in Montreal is now confronting is a significant influx of homeless street people — drunks for the most part — who find the tent city in Victoria Square more congenial to their way of life than the Brewery homeless centre a few blocks down the street. Nobody knows quite what to do. These are people who prefer to sleep outdoors in sub-zero weather.
Puts me to sleep. In about 10 minutes.
I open must posted links, but I’m not sure which you are referring to here.
They should be welcomed. OWS is about tolerance and civility, the lack of which is the reason OWS came into existence.
It’s a comprehensive archive of material on JFK assassination. Mary Ferrell started collecting secondary source material immediately afterward, my neighbor started to digitize it about a decade ago, and since then they’ve added the USG material that’s been released.
As you know, in Manhattan you can see someone smoking a joint at any time and any place in public.
That’s too simple an answer. Occupy has enough hugely difficult problems closer to their central issues & tactics to take on every social problem.
I disagree. To create a saner world, it’s more important to change attitudes than to execute tactics.
“but, unlike previous incidents, the police did not provoke the violence.”
Yes, all other incidents of violence were provoked by the cops. Why I think I veen saw some of New York’s finest holding down some women so they could be raped by other occupiers.
In order to do anything productive, it is necessary to survive. If a nascent movement tries to tackle too much too soon, they will fail.
Then they fight you:
Susie Madrak, Crooks and Liars: ‘Vulture Capitalist’ Funding Two Orgs Attacking Occupy Wall Street
Paul Singer funds Spectator and Patrick Howley (Air and Space Museum provocateur) and Josh Barro (funded by Wriston Fellowship at the Manhattan Institute).
If you’re going to post a comment like that, could you please provide a link. Thanks.
Occupy Montreal should network with Occupy Atlanta. They have been working this issue since the first week.
Expecting good faith from someone who is all about bad faith? Not a good investment, m’dear.
Thanks for link, but I have my misgivings.
is certainly of dubious veracity.
I will peruse it, but I doubt that it includes information about the meeting at a Dallas hotel on the evening of 11/21/63 in which LBJ and the Texas mob finalized their plans for the next day.
It’s called satire, dude. Kevin implied that every other incident of violence was provoked by the police.
Maybe he could post a link to support THAT absolute.
It’s just an archive, a tool. It’s not an opinion.
That would be dudette.
I missed the satire. Will be alert to it in the future.
I got really slammed the other day for saying the same thing. There is no doubt that OWS cannot take on the social ills of a city, a county or a country. Cities have been half-heartedly trying to work at this for as long as I can remember and it just gets worse. I think it is a terrible burden to put on a group of people who are working so hard to accomplish a goal that just might save our democracy, including the help needed for the poor and homeless.
It’s called, “ma’am,” dude, or, “exalted ma’am” to you.
Although archives are scrubbed, damaging information is sometimes overlooked and included. A scrupulous eye can find those gems.
Been reading the March to DC blog Kevin linked above:
https://nycmarch2dc.wordpress.com/
Favorite encounter so far:
https://nycmarch2dc.files.wordpress.com/2011/11/alim1346.jpg
Occupy Tulsa UStream
Occupy Tulsa is covering the Veterans Day parade that is coming past its campsite.
Didn’t know your interests ran in that direction. Albarelli’s new book on the subject should be showing up pretty soon (I got to write the intro for it)- he said he’s cleaning up the last 2 chapters. Was supposed to be out Nov. 1st…
A Secret Order: Investigating the High Strangeness and Synchronicity in the JFK Assassination
This is a PRIVATE archive, funded by my neighbor’s former boss, who has a personal interest in the matter. I have a read on my neighbor as a very solid citizen, in the FDL def of citizen, and she gives her former boss, who is also helping to fund her startup effort to teach ESL in China so that the rich Chinese can send their kids to U.S. colleges, a good review. I talked to him for about 15+ min at neighbors’ wedding reception, which is not enough to judge, but he didn’t set off any warning bells. We were interested in the same topics & he was well informed.
The origin of the archive was Farrell’s private collection of mostly secondary material, although I think she may have been the one to get ahold of the gunshot recording. (Don’t hold me to that.) The collection was in paper form, & my neighbor digitized it so it would be searchable & available online.
The govt material has been added as it became available.
I wasn’t interested in that subject. Just fell into my lap about a month ago, owing to a conversation with my neighbor about this little know piece of her background. See my 74.
I would not have been so sensitive to it until I visited OWS myself and was forced to think about the complications of the process, which I tried to convey in my diary.
Occupy Tulsa getting honks of support from units in the Veterans Day Parade.
On the substance of the issue we conversed for just a couple of sentences. To put it in perspective, the entire conversation was an hour, of which JFK assassination took maybe 5 min. Remember neighbor was just a technician. I asked her if she had formed any opinions about what the actual story was from working with the source material, and she said not really, that she didn’t read very much of it. She did say that the CIA was definitely behind it from what she could gather, didn’t know why or what their goal was, and there was strong evidence that LBJ was up to his neck in it.
I passed the website to my friend in TX. Her father had been in TX politics in the 40s & 50s and always claimed LBJ arranged assassinations. On the day of the JFK assassination, he did not get in touch with her (she & I were at the same college on the East Coast) until late in the day. Her father’s first words were: LBJ figured out how to become president.
FWIW
Occupy Knoxville rally livestream
That is interesting (BTW – I couldn’t find anywhere upthread about your neighbor, so I’m having trouble with context).
While I’m inclined to think that the CIA/Mafia entanglement enabled that assassination, I’ve always resisted the LBJ connection. Seems so obvious and fantastic at the same time, somehow. I think I’ll toddle over to that archive…
(And I wonder what Hank Albarelli has unearthed, as well. The whole reason for his book is because of the stuff he accumulated while investigating the Frank Olson murder.)
LS Occupy Tulsa
A motorcycle unit from some organization came by. There were guys handing out candy to the crowd lining the streets. One while handing out candy to the Occupy Tulsa contingent said “You know, I support you guys.”
LS Occupy Tulsa – battery change.
Comment 74. Moved in 9/09. Lesbian couple, Noa & Anne, married 10/10/10. 30-somethings. Met thru beekeeping in summer 10. Both went to Brandeis. Noa’s the one who started the digitizing about 8 or 10 years ago.
Thanks again Kevin. You are appreciated.
For those at Occupy Burlington who witnessed the suicide, if you are reading this or know someone who was such a witness, please talk with them, as they may be traumatized themselves. Encourage them to get professional help to deal with stress and shock stemming from their being there.
Death by gunshot is a very ugly way to die, and either witnessing it, or coming upon the victim in its immediate aftermath is often quite shocking, and can cause a serious acute stress reaction or even PTSD (especially if there is not early intervention). This is not a small matter for those involved. Please spread the word on this. Brave folk will try and soldier on, trying to do the right thing, build the movement, etc., only to be hit with a post-traumatic attack weeks or even months later.
I know whereof I speak, and have met and worked with people who have been exposed to this kind of traumatic event, as I am a licensed psychologist in clinical practice about 15 years now.
Second that. Personal experience 24 years ago.
Not to mention that suicide is still a somewhat taboo subject, so very difficult to have a conversation about it. Mentioning it tends to be a conversation stopper.
Thanks. Actually it was your #45 where I stumbled. It’s not important, but for the life of me I can’t see how the whole subject came up.
(Sorry Kevin – and TD – don’t mean to be so OT).
Third that.
#45 was OT. I had linked Farrell’s site for ghost on EMS, courtesy of something he typed, I think, but didn’t see any acknowledgement, so was just checking whether ghost had seen it, which diverted this thread.
Bob Mims, The Salt Lake Tribune: Body, possibly Occupy protester, found in SLC’s Pioneer Park
The SLC PD think it was weather-related. But….
Occupy St Louis is facing eviction from Kiener Plaza at 3pm today.
contact the mayor’s office here:
http://stlouis-mo.gov/government/departments/mayor/index.cfm
Really, shouldn’t #occupy start a body count of peeps who are sacrificing their own lives out of desperation? I mean, these deaths should be used to illustrate how hopeless and desperate people have become. It only took *one* guy in Tunisia, how many will it take here?
Body counts could also be used against Occupy, as in: Look how violent they are.
After VN, I have a strong emotional reaction against body counts for any purpose whatsoever. Even is only bc a human counts for more than a count, i.e., it seems so dehumanizing to me.
That’s already what’s happening, though. Corporate media *will* report that #occupy is violent because people are dying. The answer is to point out how the peeps are dying of poverty and desperation due to the abandonment of the social contract. These guys are veterans, ferchrissakes. The only folks willing to help them are at #occupy.
I see your point about body counts, though. It is dark and gruesome to count corpses. The truth matters, anyway, and I wish we could change the conversation to poverty, desperation, and PTSD that causes suicide.
I agree with eCAHNomics.
The way that the Occupy communities have been handling it is with vigils and remembrances and witnessing of the families of those people. Celebrating the significance of their lives as human beings is more powerful than adding them up as just another statistic.
One of the things I’ve noticed about a lot of the Occupy communities is how far from the Bernays method of messaging they are. Yes, you have to contend with a culture awash in the result of Bernays’s genius and that means that some of the forms look similar. But I’ve been struck with how the local groups have been able to fill that with authenticity and honor instead of phoniness and FUD.
eCHAN,
There have bees several threads here stating the police can lie to you however they want.
I don’t recall them exactly, but at least one has been in the last 10 days or so.
I’ll try to find it.
The communication that the Occupy communities do goes around the corporate media. The strategy has to be not to confront the corporate media (except on strategically important occasions) but to make what they say irrelevant. Or at least the propagandistic framing of Occupy Wall Street irrelevant; there are writers, especially at the local level, who are sympathetic to the Occupy Wall Street movement and make sure that stories are accurate and that the occupiers can respond in the diversity of their own words. There are local media folk who have been arrested along with the occupiers in attempts to reduce the media presence so that police can have a free hand.
More importantly there is the citizens media, which networks through Twitter and Facebook and livestreams to show as best a possible what is going on.
The vigils and rememberances are important. I want those events to connect the deaths to what is happening everywhere and to remind the PTB who accuse #occupy of violence that the folks who are taking their own lives are war vets, the homeless, the poverty stricken, and the desperate. So much of the suffering that has occurred over the last few years is a direct result of policy enacted by the 1%. Yet, the PTB openly blame #occupy for the deaths.
Had to look up Bernays.
You make an excellent point. Hadn’t thought about it that way.
And I think it is another one of the strengths of Occupy that they DON’T try to outdo, or ape, any of the tiresome, shopworn, inhumane methods of communication favored by the 1%ers.
And it’s prolly another aspect of Occupy that drives the 1%ers nuts. They have only hammers & can’t figure out what to do if their inflexible tools don’t work.
According to what’s been on this post, police are not supposed to lie to you if you ask if they are undercover, but they lie anyway.
eCHAN,
Here’s a link to a web site about whether or not the police can legally lie to you:
http://burneylawfirm.com/blog/2010/06/18/myth-2-cops-cant-lie/
wc
Diaries & testimonials from those who knew the victims might be a good addition, or oral histories for those who don’t feel up to writing it. Perhaps an archive could be started to accumulate such material.
Since cities are making noises about shutting down #occupy due to deaths in and around the camps (#oo Jean Quan), stating clearly the causes behind the deaths is *urgent*. Maybe social media is enough, maybe it is not.
That’s a great link. Thanks so much. All a myth.
For me, it didn’t matter whether it was a myth or not. I would expect undercover cop to lie. I just thought if you could document the lie, it might be helpful at some point in the future, and that if the infiltrators were overtly asked often & pointedly enough it might serve as a bit of a chilling factor.
But as I said above, I’m prolly dreaming.
Thanks for the link.
Yes, authenticity and honesty is the best remedy for propaganda. OWS has done a great job going around the media. Perhaps I’m living in an old model of communication that is being dismantled before my eyes at #occupy. Let’s see what happens…
Nothing wrong with a failed experiment. If you don’t try something different, you’ll never know.
Thanks eCAHN and Tarheel…I think you’ve just further radicalized me. I just had an aha! moment about propaganda. LOL.
Three cheers for ysd, ThD, & eCAHN.
One of the best Tweets re #Occupy (h/t to TarheelDem):
Kevin just tweeted this picture. Who is that?
I think that’s Marine Sgt Shamar Thomas, famous for yelling at the cops in this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SsGCpalVIsg
Be careful what you wish for. Cities will be shut down sooner than you think for budget reasons.
Yeah, that’ll go well.
Closing down Occupy camps because of the deaths is just another form of closing them down because of the threat to health or safety. Health and safety are the only legal reasons that cities can close them down. The use permits are a dodge in that the use permits are for the sake of regulating health and safety.
Given the widespread and content-based legal actions by cities, there is a court case and a political uproar in the making. Because….the folks who are getting arrested are far from being dirty hippies.
The “deaths in the camps” narrative is the tactic not the cause of mayors’ efforts. It is bullshit. The people know that it’s bullshit. The people will turn out to defend the camps.
Ahhh. Thanks.
BTW, thanks for the info on where supply drop for OWS is located. All went smoothly, as I related in my diary.
Every chance I get to not use Wall $treet Media/Canary Wharf Media (more here), I use the citizens media.
X2
Well, *I* think it’s bullshit, and lots of people who support #occupy will agree. However, that’s kinda my point. Will the #occupy is dangerous — look, dead bodies! meme be persuasive enough to close the camps? I don’t know.
That said…I’m willing to see #occupy do as they have already done with media. Perhaps truth and authenticity in the face of propaganda is a little bit like non-violent protesters getting beaten by authorities. It has the potential to backfire very badly on the PTB when people clearly see who is on the side of truth and justice.
I don’t wish a shutdown of any #Occupy or city. The #Occupy-ae are a reflection of the issues of a city. Why is it that City officials and the systems they run are not doing the business the people have entrusted them with?
Day 19: Inside Occupied Portland – Keeping it Safe (October 26th, 2011)
Did you see this (h/t TarheelDem):
You are welcome and thank you for your effort and generosity. Sounds like you had a good time doing it. I liked your diary.
BC it’s so easy to blame some one else.
Or bc they can get away with it.
What’s so difficult about running a well staffed, clean, nutritious food program for homeless people. It’s not rocket science. But such programs are always underfunded, poorly overseen, etc etc. BC homeless are a class of people who don’t vote, don’t contribute to campaigns, and are off the radar for most other people.
I did have a ‘good’ time. But mostly learned a lot. And that’s always a great day.
The #Occupy-ae are concrete demonstrations of who’s flapping their lips and not doing their dadgum job. My heart bleeds peanut butter for those who are embarrassed or “inconvenienced” by the disinfectant of sunlight. The city/town level of governance underpins the whole system. We shake the foundations of the old established corrupt order (h/t TarheelDem; pulling of the thread begins here) by cleaning up our collective act in our own backyards.
Did you see how Cameron wants to bring back the workhouses? See my 21 and 29.
Debtors prisons next up.
The other thing that is so disgusting about this process, which I’ve watched for decades, is that the underfunding of all programs is used as follows: See, govt spending on solving the homeless program doesn’t work; or: See, locking the mentally ill up in facilities just doesn’t word.
Then that is used as the excuse to zero out all funding for those purposes.
Rather than, um, ya know, upping the spending and running the program better.
Rs are masters at that. They do it deliberately all the time. Ds are catching up fast. If SS doesn’t keep old foggies out of poverty, then it should be zeroed out.
Folks are onto the technique. I’ve done service work at all donation-based, volunteer-run groups who run circles around the corrupt non-profits now even openly run by the same officers as corporations. I agree with Naomi Klein (this presentation was taped and is on a loop so you can just jump in and watch)– the only thing to do is for us to determine what we want to build from the rubble of this system.
As yes, the one-person non-profit. Quite a nice boondoggle for the one.
As for your other link, I’m not a pep rally kind of person.
Another group beginning, apparently.
It was a panel including the participation of ,a href=”http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rinku_sen”>Rinku Sen of the Applied Research Center and Colorlines.Com. I thought she provided some excellent criticism and commentary.
One thing to remember about statistics concerning non-profit charitable deductions. About 60% are deductions to local congregations of religions. And of that, most of the money goes into the building and the cleric’s compensation package (including a house and car). Except for very small churches are churches in poverty neighborhoods. Of the remaining 40%, about half is contributions to colleges and universities. And of the other half, a significant portion goes to institutions in the arts. The comparisons made between private donations and federal and state programs are usually framed as half-truths. Federal programs were created specifically because private charitable giving either couldn’t or wouldn’t serve the needs of the people.
The “professionalization” of the nonprofit sector and the rise of ill-conceived “social entrepreneurship” have made even less of the funds contributed get to what needs to be done.
FDLer Austinites, heads up.
Occupy Atlanta livestream
Occupy Chattanooga livestream
It’s corrupt and reenforced by a corrupt taxation system.
If I could forward to that, I might listen. As it was, I tuned when when Moore was talking. I like his films a lot, but him not so much, and he was doing a pep talk: We gotta do this, we gotta do that, now is our time, blah blah blah.
I get really pissed about stuff like that. I’ve been on the boards of 2 non-profits, both of which have taken their jobs exceedingly seriously. The contrast is gag-producing.
You’re a shitty satirist. But that’s not a problem. The New York Post might give you a weekly column.
The way the video is hooked up you can’t fast forward through it. Also, I didn’t see the video ripped to YouTube. However, you might look at this: “Rinku Sen at the NCMR 2011.”
I help a few groups that are incredibly efficient and you’ll never see them listed on CharityNavigator.Org or Guidestar.Org. Events done by one group of folks gives the complete financial accounting before the close of each event. That’s a breath-taking transparency.
I don’t think violence, targeted violence against women and targeted violence against journalists are laughing matters:
Video: G20 Toronto Police Rape Threats + Strip Searched – Amy Miller
I disagree with her entirely. The U.S. conflict is NOT about race, it is about class.
I think it was Guinier decades ago who pointed out that if USG programs were reoriented toward income groups rather than race groups, ‘left’ would be able to make its point more forcefully and take race, and all its dogwhistles, entirely ‘off the table.’
I am just chewing on what she has to say from her experience as I have also experienced discrimination even recently when class could not have possibly been in play but rather attitudes about race, gender and perceptions of “culture” were. I tend to see it as primarily economic in the US but I am not so sure about the UK.
S/He might already be a Post reporter…!
Mahalo, Kevin for all your work…! I’d asked Jane, during yesterday’s webinar, if she’d reward ya with a tour of Hawai’is Occupy’s…! *g*
I’m channeling my own sentiments, Zinn, Guinier, and Rogers & Hammerstein.
For me, I’ve never felt the slightest bit of diff based on pigmentation, even though my white parents never mixed races (European nationalities & religions were getting comfortably mixed in their generation, born at turn of 20th C).
Zinn points out that to prevent (i.e. divide) classes by race, a divide & conquer strategy, required huge efforts on the part of RWMs, like creating special benefits for poor whites wh didn’t extend to poor blacks (carrying guns to kill Indians being just one example), unequal punishments, and still that was not enough to prevent the colors from mixing, so last resort of scoundrels was to create laws, like misegenation, to prevent classes from uniting on the basis of income not color.
Guinier pointed out that if EEO programs were based on income, not color, they would reach all the intended peeps and not be able to be accused of bias.
And R&H in South Pacific who pointed out that racism is taught.
I like Guinier and your suggestion and perceive that just in the act of applying it, the true nature of the issues would be laid open. In the meantime, as the “wealth gap” increases and is solidified as structural, why wouldn’t the people who worked to get us in that position not encourage the old discriminations to reappear? Then such could be applied as a metric of just how decayed US society has become.
That is what Johnson’s War on Poverty almost did. In it’s first couple of years. Then the PtB realized what was going of an redirected the funds from going directly to community action agencies to going through the state governor’s office. I think that change occurred around 1967. The other thing that worked against it was the many local community action agency boards (public official appointees were 1/3 of the membership) hired ex-military (and also ex-OSS/CIA) folks as executive directors. I ran into this a lot in the Carolinas and Georgia.
Devin Katayama, WFPL: Occupy Louisville Demonstrators Move Locations
???
Oh I agree that the techniques they’ve used to divide & conquer are very powerful & will be in full display as long as the 1%ers can get away with them.
But I always resort to the intellectual approach to problems. First diagnose as best you can, then try to figure out what to do.
As to the latter, I have been at my wit’s end until Occupy started, which is why I have my fingers crossed.
I have a vague memory of that but don’t remember enough to feel certain. Would deserve a closer reading of the history for me to see how it actually worked. But thanks for pointing that out.
Occupy Wall Street NYC: Declaration of Occupation Flowchart art work
The analysis behind “our one demand”. Outstanding. Other locations might consider working out their own for their local situation.
You need only look at how the Newark agency’s organizing domestic workers and several Appalachian agencies’ organizing against coal companies on a variety of fronts created panic in the Congress that resulted in a change in the law.
Occupy Charleston “abridging Michele Bachmann’s freedom of speech”
Worth posting again for the Ceaucescu moment in Bachmann’s expression.
Occupy Birmingham AL
The Oakland Police Officer’s Association’s open letter to the public is disingenuous on its face. They say “We understand and sympathize with your message” and “we respect your right to peaceful protest”, but completely undermine that assertion by saying the city is in “a state of emergency”, using that theme to justify taking down the camp. There is no state of emergency in Oakland. The murder last night was outside the camp and was representative of the violence that always goes on in the city.
The Occupation has repeatedly stated its non-violent intent and it appears that 99% of the occupiers are engaged in thoughtful discussions of the problems facing the country’s 99%. They are looking at possible ways to deal with the country’s inequity, something that Washing DC politicians are unwilling to address in a meaningful manner.
I would much rather my tax dollars go towards supporting the goals of the occupation rather than wasted on police resources.
Boots Riley’s report about city relations with Occupy Oakland
“Deck the 1%: #OccupyWallStreet Playing Cards
A Board & Card Games project in New York, NY by The Yes Lab”
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/yeslab/deck-the-1-occupywallstreet-playing-cards
“You’ve been robbed by the banks, foreclosed on, and stuffed into a locker full of debt, but you still can’t pick the perpetrators of the country’s financial collapse out of a lineup?
That is all about to change thanks to the #OccupyWallStreet Playing Cards. Now, you can identify the bad guys and make the citizen arrests we desperately need.”
It’s a project of the Yes Lab.
Joel Anderson, Atlanta Journal-Constitution: Occupy Atlanta leaves Gwinnett home after family evicted
I believe that’s called “moral extortion”.
Wise words spoken by a true Soldier for this Veteran’s Day…
–Dwight D. Eisenhower
Christopher King, CBS Atlanta: Occupy Atlanta honors veterans, blasts Wall Street
One more…
I like to believe that people in the long run are going to do more to promote peace than our governments. Indeed, I think that people want peace so much that one of these days governments had better get out of the way and let them have it. –Dwight D. Eisenhower
Occupy Richmond Livestream
Deck of cards with 52 banksters might be a big fundraiser for Occupy. Nominating Lloyd Blankfein for Queen of Spades. (Hank Paulson for King?).
Oh let’s argue about it. Sounds like The Great Game.
Heh – I’ve thought that there should be a rude version of Monopoly too; with “Do Not Go To Jail – Collect One Billion Dollar Bonus” cards and replacing the Senate/White House for Park Place and Boardwalk.
Great idea.
Unfortunately, from my nanoexperience with OWS, none would be able to afford either game.
Really.
A WWII U.S. general talking about peace.
Lacks minimal creds.
The more I hear about Ike, the more I think he was the master of
golfdeceptiongolfdeception.Oh shit. I can’t figure out which way it should read.
Yasha Levine, Texas Observer: Empire Building
Johnathan Schwartz, A Tiny Revolution: In Shocking Twist No One Could Have Foreseen, Kochs’ Family Empire Founded on Government Handouts
h/t digby
Charles P. Pierce, Esquire: This Is How the 99 Percent Becomes the 100 Percent
Occupy Birmingham AL livestream
Wasn’t it Eisenhower who warned us against the military-industrial complex? I don’t think I’d be so quick to dismiss him as a hypocrite – and anyway, don’t his words speak for themselves, no matter what you think of the man?
After eight years of building it, and his Farewell Address. One of those “it’s a fine time to tell me Lucille” moments.
Kev Hedges, Digital Journal: Occupy Wall St. man proposes to partner via ‘people’s microphone’
Biggest hyp of all. A general warning about MIC doesn’t pass the giggle test.
A model for O perhaps.
Ike warned about it because he saw what was happening during his terms, it wasn’t him pushing for it, it was MIC itself…
Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and not clothed. This world in arms is not spending money alone. It is spending the sweat of its laborers, the genius of its scientists, the hopes of its children. This is not a way of life at all in any true sense. Under the cloud of threatening war, it is humanity hanging from a cross of iron… Ike (April 16, 1953)
Awwwww.
Yep. But Ike is the quintessential example that the MIC can order a President to do what it wants. Only George C. Marshall had more stature coming out of WWII to call a halt to the self-serving actions of the MIC. Subsequent presidents have not had that stature. Even Reagan backed down from negotiating an end of nuclear weapons with Mikhail Gorbachev because his aides reeled him back in.
He did not push for it but he wound up as trapped in the system as lesser presidents.
Strange Matter is a nearby local restaurant/cafe probably equipped with wifi and lots of coffee.
Consider this and how many tax payers dollar$ went up in pepper spray, rubber bullets and tear gas that night in Oakland with 10 police agencies called out.
Nation
Livestream
#oo protesters burn eviction notice.
Light is really dim on LS, hard to make anything out.
LS: giving a tour of site of police riot on last attempt to clear #OO.
LS off.
https://twitter.com/#!/search/realtime/%23OccupyOakland
http://www.ustream.tv/occupyoakland
KitOConnell Kit O’Connell
Sad news: death of 1 occupier and severe injury of 2 more in a car wreck today. I am with those keeping vigil in spirit. #occupyaustin #ows
4 hours ago
FlashOccupyATX Occupy Austin
#occupyaustin Lost an occupier today. Rest in peace Ellis McClane. Please continue to keep Clayton and Harry in your thoughts! Both in ICU.
5 hours ago
As per Kevin’s update above, Occupy St Louis may be facing eviction tonight after all.
City currently waiting for judge to make a decision.
https://twitter.com/#!/search/realtime/%23OccupySTL
The evictions are coming fast now. I’d be surprised if any group but the original OWS is left by years’s end. Sure, people can just keep trying to go back (which will just lead to ongoing arrests), but what’s the plan if that’s not possible? I know the major media has not been a friend to these Occupy events, but on the other hand, if there are no more occupiers and no news coverage, many of those 99% will just move on to the next big thing in the news. Isn’t there a way for the general assemblies to somehow meet without occupying to avoid losing momentum?
Spring rejuvenates, regardless.
Food for thought depiction: “If US land were divided like US wealth“
It’s a 40% tithe to the 1%ers for all you buy just built in with the money itself (Ellen Brown, Nov. 11, 2011)
A Message from the General Assembly of Occupy Richmond, on Behalf of the People
Gene Petriello, NBC12: Newspaper editor invites Occupy to his front lawn (Occupy Richmond)
Occupy Atlanta vs. Fannie Mae: Monday 2pm
Occupy Tulsa: 11-02-2011 Arrests photo set
Occupy Tulsa: Solidarity Square, 11-06-2011 photo set
Occupy Tulsa: Solidarity Square 11-02-2011 photo set
Dan Whitcomb, Reuters: ‘Occupy’ protesters dig in against police
Really? What drugs are the Portland PD taking?
Three young men from OccupyAustin were in a car crash in the wee hours of Friday morning. One died instantly and the other two are in comas. It was an intense day for OccupyAustin with people mourning and worried. I’ve written a diary about my experience yesterday evening at OccupyAustin.
Morning. I am on my way to Occupy New Haven in Connecticut. Also, launching live blog now.
Mexico City: Take the Streets
Anniston AL
Several people got on #OccupyPortland and just, er, made stuff up and repeated it.
Here’s someone presenting as JulieLuvsISRAEL supposedly from Lake Geneva, WI as the location information is turned on (note profile picture with Glenn Beck ; I add the bold):
Folks may not know what an “anarchist” is, but they are confident they’re bad and they’re in Portland, OR.
Gainesville FL honors its veterans