
Oregon ballot from the 2008 Election (Flickr Photo by jugbo)
During the 2008 election, the late great people’s historian Howard Zinn wrote about “election madness.” He said every four years it “seizes the country” because “we have all been brought up to believe that voting is crucial in determining our destiny, that the most important act a citizen can engage in is to go to the polls and choose on of the two mediocrities who have already been chosen for us.” It deeply bothered him that all were so “vulnerable,” whether they were liberals or radicals, to spending so much time discussing presidential elections.
“Even in the so-called left periodicals, we must admit there is an exorbitant amount of attention given to minutely examining the major candidates,” he added. “An occasional bone is thrown to the minor candidates, though everyone knows our marvelous democratic political system won’t allow them in.”
Though these “minor candidates” may not be able to win, they are people like Green Party presidential candidate Jill Stein or Libertarian Party presidential candidate Gary Johnson, who get on enough state ballots necessary to win enough electoral votes to assume the presidency. They overcome strict ballot access laws that more well established political parties—the Democratic and Republican Parties—never have to bother with during elections. And the left-leaning press is, for the most part, either completely repulsed or indifferent toward their inclusion in the election and spend an excessive amount of time going over state polls, which cause them to go into a frenzy over the closeness of the election.
Wasting Your Vote
MSNBC host Lawrence O’Donnell covered third party candidates in this election last week after they held a debate in Chicago moderated by former CNN show host Larry King. O’Donnell endorsed a “safe state” strategy. He said to people thinking of voting third party, “You will be told you`re wasting your vote if you vote for a third party candidate, because the third party candidate is not going to win the presidency. Well, I guess that means everyone who voted for John McCain for president or John Kerry for president wasted their votes, too.”
O’Donnell recounted for viewers:
…Having spent my lifetime in states irrelevant to the Electoral College, I have mostly, in fact, voted for third party candidates for president. And I was always told I was wasting my vote. When I voted for Democrats for president who lost, I was never told I was wasting my vote. I have actually voted for the winner of the presidency exactly once.
So please don`t try to tell me that voting for a candidate who loses is wasting a vote in a democracy. If you live in a battleground state, voting for a third-party candidate can be a lot dicier. Just ask the people who voted for Ralph Nader in Florida in 2000. If you`re lucky enough to live in a state that the presidential candidates care about, then your vote really does count in the way most people want it to. Then you really should think about who you want to see take the Oath of Office when you cast your vote, because your vote matters much, much more than mine… [emphasis added]
It is a bit difficult to tell if he was blaming Nader voters for the outcome or if he is saying that they are remembered as a factor because the election outcome was uncomfortably close and this should be how it is in all states. But, let’s recognize that people in swing states do have power. Those who live in swing states, who are upset with the status quo and the current two-party system that keeps so many issues off the table in the elections, can be a factor. Yet, there are progressive leaders who are doing the work of Obama for America volunteer teams by seeking to dissuade those in swing states from voting, who they really may want to vote for in the election.
“Safe States” Strategies
Put forward by Daniel Ellsberg, Cornel West, Frances Fox Piven, Barbara Ehrenreich, Marjorie Cohn, Jim Hightower, Jeff Cohen and Norman Solomon, these known progressives have called for Mitt Romney to be defeated “without illusions” about President Barack Obama. They say they have “consistently challenged Obama policies (on civil liberties, war and bloated military spending, environment, potential cuts to Social Security and Medicare, to name a few)” but “know that the policies of a Romney/Ryan administration would be worse on many issues and better on none.”
“Consider Romney’s recent vow to ‘change course’ toward even more warmongering in the Middle East. Or their profound differences on abortion rights and Supreme Court picks,” they write. And, they add, “We also know that whether Obama or Romney wins on November 6th will be decided in a dozen states known as ‘swing’ or ‘battleground’ states because they’re so close they could go either way. Those states now include Colorado, Florida, Iowa, Michigan, Missouri, Nevada, New Hampshire, New Mexico, North Carolina, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Virginia and Wisconsin.”
This is not a novel idea. Medea Benjamin, Peter Coyote, John Eder, Daniel Ellsberg, Tom Hayden, Norman Solomon and others put out a similar letter that called on progressives to “strategically” vote in the 2004 Election. It said a “few percentage points separate” George W. Bush and John Kerry. Activists in “swing states” were encouraged to “mobilize voters behind Kerry.” They encouraged people to vote for Green Party presidential candidate David Cobb in “safe states,” where it was certain Kerry would win. And they also urged advocacy for instant runoff voting and other reforms so in “future elections” voters could “support the candidate they most believe in without risk of electing the candidate they most oppose.” (Note: Eight years later, none of these people who signed this 2004 letter could be said to have had any more than a minimal impact when it comes to advancing the cause of electoral reform.)
“Safe states” strategies reinforce the fear people have for actually voting as citizens and not managers of democracy. Here’s an adObama for America released called “537.” It implicitly raises the specter of Ralph Nader costing Al Gore the election. When it was covered on MSNBC on October 24, host and devout Obama supporter Chris Matthews said, “You play games voting for the third-party candidate,” after the ad was shown, indicating the ad’s purpose was not necessarily for those who would stay at home and not vote but also for jolting those who would vote for someone like Jill Stein.
Helping to Prevent a Challenge to the Democratic Party from Forming
It may seem like this kind of open letter to progressives in support of a “safe states” strategy would help the Green Party or an alternative force to corporate Democratic politics grow, but what it does is discourage citizens from going too far outside the confines of the Democratic Party. And, so long as Democratic candidates for president like Obama can be sure of the progressive vote, they do not care what progressives do in between elections or how fierce they are in their advocacy between elections. As the Obama administration has proven on a vast array of issues, they can easily tune the “Professional Left” out and go about business as usual.
Lance Selfa, author of Democrats: A Critical History, writes in his book the candidacy of Cobb was a result of liberal or progressive forces working with people within the Green Party to ensure there was no meaningful challenge to the “militaristic hyper-cautious Kerry campaign.” Nader ran as an independent and received more votes than Cobb, despite the fact that his campaign was understaffed and underfunded and liberal forces were viciously attacking him. And the result of Cobb’s “safe states” campaign was that it lost “ballot status” or recognition as a political party in at least seven states.
If third party candidacies are to create space for the impossible by putting pressure on the candidates from the Republican and Democratic parties, then a “safe states” strategy or any kind of strategic voting must be regarded as something that reinforces the status quo. The progressive leaders prescribing this strategy recognize the electoral process is corrupt and deficient yet they are timid and unwilling to wage an organized action that might have an outcome that outraged a mass of people and forced political leaders into a situation where significant electoral reforms were necessary.
Howie Hawkins, a Green Party activist, has said, “Popular Front, fusion, inside-outside and safe states are all of the same genus of lesser evilism. By relying on the liberal wing of the corporate power structure to defend us from its right wing, the left surrenders its own voice and very identity as an alternative to corporate domination. And history shows, when push comes to shove, that the corporate liberals ally with their conservative counterparts against the people. “
Moreover, one should not consider it settled that Mitt Romney would, if president, outlaw abortion or bomb Iran. In 1973, when the Supreme Court decided Roe v. Wade, it was filled with conservative appointees. Richard Nixon opposed choice for women and was president. Yet, thousands of women and men demonstrated for a women’s rights in the years preceding the decision and created a climate where the Supreme Court decided they should issue a decision that would essentially legalize abortion. Nixon ended the Vietnam War because of the strength of the antiwar movement.
The Future of This Democratic Republic
The details of Obama’s policy positions, his actions and what he said he would do but did not do in his first term can be gone over with a fine-toothed comb. One can make a pretty solid hypothetical and empirical case that he would be just as toxic to progressive causes as Romney would be in his second term and Romney would have to struggle as president to outdo Obama on some very key issues. However, too much emphasis on their identities and what one predicts they will or will not do obscures the future focus, which people should have.
From a left perspective, there should be a concern about what investments of time, energy and resources do to the left. It is unclear what progressive leaders or progressive media organizations gain from telling their readers they endorse a vote for Obama without illusions when they editorially oppose a majority of what he has done or failed to do. It is not like those counting votes can see in the tally the number of people who voted with illusions and no illusions and make a differentiation. The votes still amount to a vote for Obama and the tacit endorsement diminishes the power leaders or organizations would have had if they had been silent and not made some collective announcement.
Moreover, these elections where people make decisions about whether they’ve reached a point where they can break with the two-party system or not are bigger than building a left. Opposing unbridled militarism, unchecked executive power or the further transformation of the federal government into an oligarchy or plutocracy is not left wing. There is broad support for this opposition from the grassroots across the political spectrum. That is because militarism, executive power and plutocratic policies come from what the late Sen. George McGovern called the “empty decaying void” of the “establishment center.”
Those who support candidates outside the two-party system show the utmost concern for the health of America as a democratic republic. They truly demonstrate a commitment to a future where elections are more democratized, where the people have more of a voice. Their votes help to create the space for any movement to reform the electoral process by instituting instant run-off voting, ranked-choice voting, abolishing the Electoral College, getting money out of politics, abandoning the Commission on Presidential Debates, reforming draconian ballot access laws or imposing term limits on members of Congress, etc. After all, it is tough to imagine any movement for meaningful electoral reform having any power if that power is not a factor in elections somehow.
Zinn recognized, “Historically, government, whether in the hands of Republicans or Democrats, conservatives or liberals, has failed its responsibilities, until forced to by direct action: sit-ins and Freedom Rides for the rights of black people, strikes and boycotts for the rights of workers, mutinies and desertions of soldiers in order to stop a war.” Voting, to Zinn, was “easy and marginally useful.” But it is not how he would ever expect the people to stop a president from committing any heinous or appalling act, like making it illegal for women to get abortions or starting another bloody and endless war.
Progressives should take this seriously. Movements are fairly weak in this country and, to the extent that they become powerful, they almost always trade their power away too quickly once the Democratic Party leadership recognizes they pose a threat to the current order. Were there healthy and sustainable movements in this country that had the power to affect and/or effect change, the hysteria about some fellow citizen’s third party vote going to elect Romney over Obama would be even more nonsense. One would be confident those movements would be present after Election Day to force whomever was in office to do whatever the fierce urgency of now required.



105 Comments

I fully “endorse” and highly recommend, to the conscience and serious consideration of all members of the Firedoglake community, whatever their “position”, this superbly excellent examination of voting and the acts actually necessary to affecting public policy.
Well done, and thank you, Kevin.
DW
Kudos as well Kevin. Make me think til it hurts sometimes and that is a good thing. I see another book in your future; maybe a modern day The Republic which will come in handy as we pick up the pieces of our putative Democracy and go FORWARD to a more perfect union. We are all in this together.
I’ve been writing posts like this since 2008. I could write a book.
I would buy it. And it should then become required reading as a course in College.
Kevin, this is very well argued. Save it and republish it early in the next election cycle. The problem that third parties have is that they are recognized in the left blogosphere too late to build anything more than symbolic momentum. No third party that is not on the ballot in all fifty states is going to win. No third party that cannot early on demonstrate that it can pull a substantial vote (and that means that it has to finance its own first polling) is going to get the attention of established media. Being able to get a third party candidate on the ballot in all fifty states is going to have to be a major objective of progressives for 2016. That means having the necessary signatures and filing fees in place at the earliest moment that candidates can register. That means prior to that time having the volunteers already in place long before this raising the name recognition and positions of the candidate. And that requires some consensus among the very many progressive third parties on a fusion team of candidates so that there is a coalition of progressive voters. Just start with the fact that the third party efforts gained traction in the left blogosphere behind the curve; kudos to Jill Stein and Rocky Anderson for that. And that only became possible because the Occupy movement brought this range of candidates to a lot of people through their open soapbox sessions.
The “safe states” strategy is not only a product of third parties. It is the way that the Democratic and Republican parties pick establishment candidates. It informs the calculus of where campaign resources go. And it denies voters better choices. The “safe states” strategy is a marketing strategy related to the marketing frame of current US elections. A third party effort need not follow the same high-cost strategy of running a campaign that the money-loaded major parties do.
The question of the relationship between movemental politics and party politics is an important one. And one we need more diaries and discussions about pretty soon to get ahead of the curve on the midterm elections. Looking at the relationship of progressives and the Democratic Party since 1968 is exactly not the model relationship; the results speak for themselves. The relationship between the conservative movement and the Republican Party is more instructive from a strategic and tactical perspective. More relevant, IMO is the relationship between the various progressive, socialist, and labor movements at the turn of the 20th century and the rise of the Socialist Party that scared the shit out of FDR.
Movements never become parties without co-option by some institution or another. That is why temporary alliances might be more important than permanent commitments. That is harder to do when you are building from a minority position, but co-option is more seductive the more powerful the movement becomes. Job one is to build a geographically and demographically wider movement that takes away safe states for everyone regardless of the fortunes of any emergent third party campaign.
When Democrats can write off all of the South, most of the Great Plains states, and a handful of Mountain states, the safe states strategy becomes more seductive. Likewise for Republicans and the Pacific Coast and the Northeast. Those who want to break the duopoly need a stronger presence in the states that Republicans count on as much as in the states that Democrats count on. The Occupy movement in the red states began to build those sort of cross-ideological conversations. That process needs to be restarted after the election.
What is always startling to me is the way the professional left turns left and mows down those who even just raise questions about the Democratic party. This with what often seems to be far greater viciousness then they bring to bear on the right, greater even than the right brings to bear on third partiers. Witness Matt Stoller on Sam Seder’s Majority Report or on Huffington Post Live discussing his recent Salon article.
The responsibility is somehow always on us not to betray, to get in line, and never on the center left to accomodate our concerns.
I have long respected Peter Coyote, Ellsberg, Chomsky, et al. And I once understood the safe tactic as part of a longer term strategy. But I no longer believe there is time for a longer term strategy. Given the recent reports that the dire effects of climate change are appearing much more rapidly than even the worst predictions of last couple of years, the longer term strategy no longer makes any sense. It seems possible to me that we are only a generation or two away from global extinction.
More militant (not violent) but militant tactics are required, a break from centrist Democrats and Republicans that forces them to take seriously the concerns of those who have broken away, akin to the Populist movements during the last gilded age.
Well said. Thank you.
Great response.
Putting my stamp of approval on Obama’s first term is supposed to be a “safe” use of my vote?
I can’t think of a better way to ensure that this country keeps marching to the right.
I would say that unless sections of the left blogosphere are confronted by people who believe in democratizing elections then this is always going to be the way elections unfold. Loyalty, fear or lack of political imagination effectively brushes third party candidates to the side. It means nobody sticks up for them when the Republicans and Democrats are working to get them thrown off state ballots.
Yes, I agree. It seems like they have been reported on more during this election. Is that because neither of them are named Ralph Nader? I do not know.
In the short term, voting for these candidates is not something people should do with the expectation of victory. They will lose. But, if the percentage of people supporting them grows, they become a more decisive factor and the power elite have to compensate. It may also create space for advocacy campaigns for meaningful electoral reform. That is what we should hope would be the outcome from playing the game of rigged electoral politics and understanding from the beginning one will not be making it to the White House.
Yes, I think it is because Ralph Nader finally retired.
Also, rayne at emptywheel has this:
“First, the overwhelming majority of Americans do not realize how very thin and brittle this democracy is–if we have one at all. I’ve done the math in my own state, and the numbers are probably very similar in yours based on conversations over the years with activists nationwide. A scant 4000 people who show up and do the work actually make democracy run for a state with a ballpark population of ten million.
4000/10,000,000 = roughly 0.0004 of the entire state is actively engaged.
Not even 1% of this state’s residents. Hell, the über-wealthy 1% are more numerous.
That’s it. Active members (not merely voters) of both major parties combined comprise less than 1% of the population. The other parties have so few people actively involved as to be statistically irrelevant. Go ahead, throw a tantrum about a beloved third party–the fact remains if a third party isn’t de-listed in this or other states, it may be close for lack of adequate numbers of voters.
Second, all kinds of arrogant boneheads think they know enough about politics and its process in America to tell others what what’s wrong with it. Virtually ALL of these opinionators are not a member of that less-than-1%-actively-involved, and probably never have been. I’ve seen them from my perspective as an activist, and I’ve seen them as an editor/journalist–they don’t know anything based on actual experience, but they’ll dump all kinds of opinion and call it fact.
Thirdly, based on what I’ve learned inside the trenches, it’s bloody hard to launch and sustain a movement in this country if you don’t have the right people with the right smarts. With so few Americans actually investing effort in the political process, political leaders are those who simply show up. That’s all it takes. Unfortunately, not everyone who shows up is a charismatic, well-trained genius who can coalesce an organization that can fight back successfully against corporate-funded behemoths. We have political leadership by default, not purely by merit.”
Check out the first part of rayne’s diary Foxes are to Hen House Security as Bankers are to Occupy
About 4,000 folks do the work for the major parties in a state of 10 million. Or equivalent to 132,000 folks do the work for the major parties nationwide. That is a staggering estimate. Almost as interesting as the fact that $10,000 in one chunk will buy you access to a Congresscritter.
The only way to waste your vote is by not voting. Those claiming that you wasted your vote just don’t like the way you voted.
Sod them.
*heh* I insist that ya write that book, Kevin…!
“Historically, government, whether in the hands of Republicans or Democrats, conservatives or liberals, has failed its responsibilities, until forced to by direct action: sit-ins and Freedom Rides for the rights of black people, strikes and boycotts for the rights of workers, mutinies and desertions of soldiers in order to stop a war.”
Direct action (Peaceable) is the singular means of achieving it, Period…! That’s exactly why I Occupy…! *g*
Kevin, brilliant as always. It’s a bit of a surprise for me to hear O’Donnell, who fell on to my permanent “f*ck ‘em” list with his sneering “insider” defense of Obama in 2010, telling disappointed progressives that we just don’t understand how Zero is trying his hardest, talk about voting third party, but of course he’s the sort of elitist “pragmatist” who argues against actually rocking the boat with any meaningful support outside the duopoly paradigm.
“Safe states” keeps the election safe for the Corruption Party, both D and R brands. It reinforces the lie that only the noble liberals of the poor helpless “Democratic” Party can actually improve are lives…and they’re trying, honest! If only they had bigger margins in Congress. Or, possibly, a pony.
Screw that. And them.
Worst case: the left loyally votes for Obama, and he loses anyway. Then we wind up with the worst of both worlds – the Dems go on taking us for granted and RMoney dicks us over for the next 4 years.
Why do you think the president matters to what you want as progressives?
Let’s say you got your dream progressive elected president; then what?
What argument would your super dream ideal progressive president say to Speaker Boehner to get him to bring his Republican caucus to support your progressive agenda?
If your ideal progressive president were simply going to have fire side chats to get voters to call their members of Congress to vote for the tax hikes they promised to block, why doesn’t your progressive just teach all the candidates for Congress what to say to get the voters to vote for a progressive Congress.
The conservatives spent decades remaking the Republican Party to be what they wanted it to be. Why not go into the Republican Party and return it back to the 1900 when progressives like Teddy Roosevelt led the Republican Party?
Voting is crucial to our destiny.
For instance, a few hundred votes in Florida dramatically changed our destiny. Had Gore won in 2000, there are 3 things I am certain would not have occurred that will plague this nation for a minimum of a generation.
1. The Bush tax cut – deficits;
2. Iraq – untold human suffering and loss of treasure; and,
3. Roberts and Alito – Citizen$ United.
Yes, the difference between the two parties is less than some on the Left might desire, but there is a difference and that difference has consequences.
Kevin, this is great!
The problem of course is that only with Obama out of the White House will the Obots be stripped of their illusions. The analysis here is so seriously bad, and so seriously promoted by so many otherwise good people, that I think it richly deserves one of these:
http://youtu.be/fRamB30E9mU
QED.
Of course, if Gore had been candidate-enough to win his own state, Tennessee, Florida wouldn’t have been a problem.
Good luck with Oklahoma.
Well it’s good that someone is certain.
* Ahem! Ahem! or Rocky Anderson.
*heh* Jill already has my vote, literally, bw…!
Please show me proof that our votes are verifiably counted and are safe from being hacked. Then, your statement might mean something.
Please, show me. Don’t call me a conspiracy nut, just show me. I’m not attacking you, I’m just asking for confirmation that the system isn’t rigged.
Seeing as how my state voting commission can’t show me, nobody in the media cares to even mention, much less investigate it, and by law, you’re not allowed to see the tangled mess of proprietary software and network of contractor data, I’m confident you can’t.
For the government to say we can’t prove the system is corrupt because we can’t see it is absolutely BACKWARDS. The government needs to transparently show how the system IS secure. That’s the minimum criterion, but nobody cares that that is clearly NOT the case.
If we were in a little town hall and put all our handwritten ballots in a black box and then someone went into a back room where no one else could witness the counting, burned all the ballots and then came out and announced a winner, would you consider that voting? I don’t, it’s willful ignorance and actively participating in a scam being perpetrated on oneself.
If we don’t have a legitimate means of tabulating votes in this country, EVERY vote is wasted and going to the polls to line up behind a machine owned, operated, certified, secured and sold by defense contractors to get a god-damned red white and blue sticker and then think you’ve “done your duty” is obscene.
The Imaginary Presidents argument.
If he had won in 2008, Imaginary President McCain would have extended the Bush tax cuts, tried to stay in Iraq beyond Bush’s agreement, bombed Libya, and expanded the war in Afghanistan, Pakistan, Yemen, and Somalia, and appointed Monsanto-friendly people to the Supreme Court and the FDA, and many of us would be saying how Imaginary President Obama would never have done that.
Heh. Not only that, but in Florida, more than 200,000 registered Democrats crossed party lines to vote for Bush. That’s approximately five times the number of registered Democrats who voted for Nader.
Oklahoma is not as much a problem as you might think. I would not give up on anywhere there was a viable Occupy movement before the November coordinated evictions. Salt Lake City, Boise, Oklahoma City, Tulsa, Mobile, Savannah, Birmingham, Columbia SC all had viable encampments. Enough that on October 15 there were spinoff actions in all sorts of unlikely places – Macon GA, Jackson MS, Valdosta GA, Norman OK, Stillwater OK, Fayetteville AR, Jonesboro AR, Denton TX.
But that was a movement that appeared by the contagion of an idea. Which is where movemental politics comes in. There is no state in the country that has not at some time in its history seen a progressive movement appear and for which that could be cited as a tradition. There is no county and likely no precinct in America that is without a significant number of Democrats and independents who likely as not are opposed to 1% control of government.
It is all too easy to buy into the conservative frame that these areas are naturally culturally conservative. When it actually takes 24-7 radio propaganda and other interventions to hold that conservative power together.
My wife takes me for granted, my kids take me for granted, my boss takes me for granted, my frigging dog takes me for granted for crying out loud. When I go to the store and give them my money they take me for granted. When I deposit my check at the bank, the bank takes me for granted.
I’m tired of being taken for granted dammit. No more, I’m pissed.
“All I know is first you’ve got to get mad. You’ve got to say, “I’m a human being. God Dammit, my life has value.” So, I want you to get up now. I want all of you to get up out of your chairs. I want you to get up right now and go to the window, open it, and stick your head out, and yell, “I’m as mad as hell, and I’m not going to take this anymore!”
Rationalize all you want oldgold. Bottom line, why would ANY ideological Liberal or Progressive vote for any “Democrat” who promises to cut Social Security AND Medicare? Unbelievable, absolutely unbelievable.
It’s fascinating to see the differences between the left and the right in how each tries to get the mass of Americans to come around to their way of thinking.
The left wing, perhaps influenced by the sort of Marxism-Leninism that has been in style for several decades, often takes a dim view of the electoral process. (I remember watching online in the mid-’90s as David McReynolds was savaged by his fellow far-lefties on the Socialist Liberty listserv because he was running for president; they weren’t angry at him because he had no chance of winning, they were angry at him because by running, he was lending validity to a system they wanted to see collapse and die so they could then leap into the power vacuum and gather the mass of Americans under their leadership.)
The right wing, on the other hand, may or may not like democracy, but they get a special pleasure out of manipulating it. The ones who hate democracy think of gaming it as fun and necessary, the electoral version of “bleeding the beast”. They are quite willing to back someone whose vision, though it may not align perfectly with theirs, is nonetheless closer to theirs than is that of the guy/gal from the other major party.
This is why, in the Florida of 2000, a state that was evenly divided once 30,000-odd former felons and other folk were kept off the rolls, Pat Buchanan got only one-sixth the votes Nader got.
This is also why Republicans love to throw money at the Greens and other lefty fringe parties — and in the case of the Pennsylvania Green Party circa 2005 and 2006, pretty much owned it lock, stock and barrel. (To be fair, many Greens nowadays refuse to take GOP money that’s sent to them, and donate it to various charities.) And it’s also why the Republicans, led by Dick Armey and the Kochs, moved very quickly to reabsorb the Tea Party, which actually started out as a genuine third party capable of doing to the GOP what the GOP wants the Greens and the Naderites to do to the Democrats.
So? G.W. Bush never won Connecticut, and Romney’s going to lose both Massachusetts and Michigan.
Mary in IL @ 27
There is nothing imaginary about my argument.
The 3 examples I used are rock solid. They all occurred with disastrous consequences. None of them of them would have, if Gore had been elected President.
Bailey @ 31
I hate to break this to you, but tens of millions are going to in just a few days. So, believe it!
Never said the events were imaginary. What any of us think Al Gore would or wouldn’t have done is imaginary. Just as in my examples, none of the events are imaginary, what any of us would have thought Obama would or would not have done compared to a President McCain is imaginary.
Jill Stein tweeted today a quote from Eugene Debs “I would rather vote for something I want and not get it than vote for something I don’t want and get it”.
It’s even worse than that.
Per Kevin above:
Presumably because voting 3rd party will cause a Republican to get elected.
Well guess who Matthews voted for in 2004?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bush_Democrat
The rank hypocrisy of Matthews & Markos Moulitsas (a former Republican), who actively and actually put these Republicans in office, giving sanctimonious lectures to those who do not is beyond offensive.
But this level of Orwellian hypocrisy is par for the course for these people.
Mary in IL @ 36
No, it is not imaginary to say Gore would not have pushed thru the Bush tax cuts, invaded Iraq or appointed Roberts/Alito type Justices.
I’m very disappointed in FDL’s coverage of the Presidential election. I wouldn’t have cared, except for it’s amazing contributions to the Liberal community during Obama’s first two years.
This article falls short simply because it ignores the obvious. First, Obama has demonstrated beyond question his disdain for Progressives, Liberals and anyone on the left who dares challenge what he sees as his perogatives. Second, at the same time he has made obvious his respect for those from the left who play for keeps, who stand up and tell him it’s their way or nothing. Third, the stakes in this election are enormous for Liberals and Progressives. Obama has clearly stated he will cut Social Security & Medicare, the holy grail for Democrats. It’s not reasonable that he will listen to any pleas from the left if he wins. Fourth, Democrats will hold the Senate. Obviously, they stand to win ONLY if they remember they are Democrats and act accordingly (something they have not done for 2 1/2 years.
So, Lefties don’t need to demonstrate, they don’t need to “fear” Romney. All we need to do is vote to oust ALL Incumbants, BOTH Parties and when we are not thrilled with a “new” Candidate vote 3rd Party. The results will be clear: First, Obama WILL lose. Second, the Democratic Party will accept Lefties are serious and MUST be listened to. And third, we can all begin the search for a 2012 Candidate who steadfastly demonstrates he/she passionately believe and fight for the promises Obama made to us in ’08.
This strategy is not a pipe dream. It was clearly substantiated, for starters by the ALL of the Polls during the HCR process (that Obama ignored) showing 70% of people believe and want what Progressives (Jane & team were way out in front of this) were fighting for.
Who would you have expected more from as President Gore, Kerry or Obama?
It is absolutely imaginary.
In my imaginary world, Gore would have suffered a “heart attack” and Joe Asshole Lieberman would have started Cheney’s wars instead.
“Progressive” in this scenario seems to mean people who would vote for a Progressive Democrat if one were running, but since there isn’t one, they’ll vote instead for the Democratic candidate who has clearly articulated and policies of endless war,drilling/mining/fracking, austerity, a security/surveillance state, ”free” trade agreements, privatization promoted of public services, and the relentless upward transfer of wealth, and who is pro-compromise on important social issues.
It’s not so important what labels people give themselves, as much as it is what actual policies they are voting for by votingt for a particular candidate.
For ideological Dems, this election has NOTHING to do with how terrible those meanie Republicans are. It has everything to do with drawing a line in the sand over what Obama has done and promises to do. For some, it’s Obama’s role in torture of Bradley Manning. For others it’s the holy grail – Obama’s promise to cut Social Security AND Medicare.
NO ideological Democrat can vote for Obama because of this, it’s that easy. If Lefties don’t like Romney, we can vote for Jill Stein or Rocky Anderson or, depending upon where we draw the line, we can even vote for Gary Johnson because it’s a sure bet Congress would do NOTHING he wants.
So, Obama’s out. Who’s in?
Honestly, I expected about the same for all of them.
I had slightly higher hopes for Obama, only in that he seemed smart enough not to “stay the course” when the Blue Dog/Third Way approach inevitably blew up in his face. But again, I expected a corporatist. I didn’t expect him to be this bad though.
If Barack could be so criminally disappointing, I don’t understand why people thinking Gore or Kerry wouldn’t have been just as tragic.
I mean, come on. Gore had Libermann for his VP pick for heaven’s sake. If people can’t read between the lines on that, I don’t know what they are thinking…
Kevin, this was very well done.
“…Their votes help to create the space for any movement to reform the electoral process by instituting instant run-off voting, ranked-choice voting, abolishing the Electoral College, getting money out of politics, abandoning the Commission on Presidential Debates, reforming draconian ballot access laws or imposing term limits on members of Congress, etc. After all, it is tough to imagine any movement for meaningful electoral reform having any power if that power is not a factor in elections somehow…..”
Hadn’t seen the argument before. It’s very compelling.
I’m not buying your assertion that the “safe state strategy,” somehow deflates the responsibilities of people in “safe” states to vote for Jean Stein. I’d encourage FDL to consider putting a “full-court press,” on FDLers in “safe” states to vote 3rd party. It’s the spring board to the midterm primaries when we have some leverage. I thought you missed an opportunity to say that and it’s true in local, state, and federal elections. It’s clearly one area where libs/progs are not getting it done. In Wisconsin, Kathleen Falk (Labor) took on Tom Barrett (D) in a bruising, expensive primary before Tom lost to Scott Walker in the recall.
“I’m very disappointed in FDL’s coverage of the Presidential election.”
How much are you contributing? Do you think the place runs on air?
People need to check out what choices are on the ballot or registered for write-in status in their state. For me, in IL, it’s Jill Stein.
Mary in IL @ 43
Your comment suggests you believe only 1 or 2 percent of the electorate is “progressive.” You might want to reconsider this particular assertion.
I don’t know what it means to “be” or “not be” progressive. I only know what candidates, representing what policies, people support.
In my imaginary world, President Jesus would have won a last minute write-in campaign with Santa Claus as his running mate.
Kevin, here’s another tough issue.
If I think the rule of law in all three branches of government, is in danger for most of the country, that we’re at a Weimar moment, I’m more likely to vote for Obama in Wisconsin. IMHO, he AND THE DEMOCRATS are less likely to suppress the votes of the poor and minorities, less likely to clamp down on our civil disobedience.
If I think the rule of law is relatively intact, far from perfect, but we’re not yet at the point of passing the Nuremburg laws (Germany 1933) than I’m more willing in Wisconsin to vote for Jill Stein and risk a Romney Presidency. Women and ethnic minorities have not had Habeas Corpus or the Bill of Rights for the majority of our nation’s history.
Kevin, I would have preferred that you take on the voter suppression issue. The very strong argument is that if Romney wins, he and the GOP will suppress large swathes of the poor and elderly’s vote. I think you need to address that.
Same here, Jill’s on the ballot in my state. I’ll vote for her with a smile on my face.
Ooh goodie! I live in a swing state! I didn’t know that before! That’s gonna make my electoral experience ten times as much fun! Gonna get that Jill Stein/Cheri Honkala sign front and center by Friday noon at the latest!
I love you, Kevin! I promise, I will buy your book. (And I don’t usually buy new releases – in fact, I think I never have, come to think of it. :~/ )
With a smile on my face
I shall vote tah dah dah, tah dah dah
Just a smile to replace
Drones and bankers all over the place…
[Song writer I ain't.]
The alternate universe where Gore became President was “rock solid” too? Can you tell us how we can access the technology that allowed you to observe this alternate universe?
And, what’s more, OLDGOLD, timesthree can demonstrate direct access to alternative histories!
Whereas with Obama in the White House they won’t do any such thing, because….
No, wait…
O’Donnell once said that Democrats are never going to do anything for liberals until liberals show Democrats that they will not vote for them.
Nothing, anymore.
Didn’t have that option in CA, so I went the other way – Gary Johnson (he’s a LOT more of a social liberal than Barry.
You are aware the Dems control and are in no chance of losing the Senate?
Only with an Obama victory will the contradictions become truly heightened — only then will the Obama faithful sell out everything they claim to believe in, while Obama himself gives us everything Paul Ryan promised us his administration would do. So if one is a Marxist-Leninist, a vote for Obama will do the trick.
maybe you are. A job’s a job these days.
because the DEMS depend on key parts of those demographics to stay in power. Dems in Wisconsin, largely successfully, have been fighting tooth and nail against voter ID.
Now you want me to vote for Tommy Thompson?
I wish this statement was the mantra for lefties of the left!
I appreciate your honesty. So to whom are you donating?
Does Obama support “the Dems” in everything? Or does he just co-opt their efforts?
Really beneath you.
I would vote for Jill regardless of the scenario .Virtually every name on the list ,excluding Cornell West ,is a loyal dem and that’s fine ,but I’m not awed by anyone’s brilliance .I must note ,however , Norman Solomon[‘s only claim to fame is being a dem ax man who has been more predictable than a groundhog in surfacing to bash third parties for nearly three decades.
Only a fool would talk in terms of winning ,especially a professional committed to direct action , and who is building an impressive rap sheet.in the process.To rail against people who have ,indisputably ,better positions on the issues ,strong beliefs ,and values that won’t be sold to the highest bidder ,is just repugnant and a statement as to why progressive values are ridiculed and relegated to the trash heap of powerless pariahs .”"This fucking retard” will always have somewhere else to go with my pittance of financial support.
I can think of valid reasons to vote for dems ,but dems should just come to terms with the reality that some of us don’t want to be part of their corporate-owned club and its lesser-evil strategies that must move us further into hard fascism .
Oh, I forgot. Obama is really like Gandhi or Nelson Mandela.
http://youtu.be/sV3w7OD2pDs
Just ask him.
Hey Kev ,as always , great job with the info and progressive inspiration . thanks
“I would say that unless sections of the left blogosphere are confronted by people who believe in democratizing elections then this is always going to be the way elections unfold.”
Exactly, Kevin (and rest assured that what follows is not aimed at you, as I find your tireless work exceptional and inspirational).
But I’ve been confronting the left blogosphere with comments that pull no punches for years, only to see said comments attacked, disappeared and my right to make them banned by authoritarian “owners” like Moulitsas. In a recent comment, Jane Hamsher asserted that FDL does not ban or censure, yet I was present on a thread many months ago where she did just that, immediately and clearly out of pique, to a commenter who tried, with painful-to-read delicacy, to confront her self-aggrandized neutrality which many third party advocates find cowardly. Outraged that someone would dare to divine how front-pagers would be voting, she donned her Marcos mask and, boom – he was gone… this from someone who proudly states that she doesn’t even give a damn about elections. If FDL can not endorse a Jill Stein or Rocky Anderson or even a Ralph Nader then where should “people who believe in democratizing elections” go for the support necessary to build the “movements” you accurately describe as “weak?”
And then there’s the insistence on “civility” while discussing uncivil issues like war crimes, the murder of innocents and the torture/prosecution of whistleblowers who have the courage to bring them to the public’s attention. Drop an “f” bomb and some Ms. Manners type pops up to admonish patronizingly that any such expressed anger is counter-productive, to which I reply: when a Democratic president, advertising himself as a constitutional scholar destroys the very constitutional law he supposedly cherishes, he has earned the right to be called a murderous bastard, a fraud and be told to fuck off even when more eloquent language is available. Wouldn’t it be better that such people (myself included) be, as LBJ famously said of J.E. Hoover, “inside the tent pissing out than outside the tent pissing in?” Apparently not… we’re supposed to hold it in so that margaret can sleep better at night. Maintaining one’s thin skin is not the best armor for weak movements in the heat of the battle.
Today in “The Nation” John Nichols, its most active partisan hypocrite, pulls out his pom-poms and puts on his cheerleading skirt (and please, I’m gay so anyone who would read it as latent homophobia is completely off base) to glorify the odious Michael Bloomberg’s pro-Obama endorsement. Here’s the confrontational comment I left there:
“Your willingness to see anything good in Michael Bloomberg, especially his endorsement of our murderer-in-chief, for what you call the “right reasons” tells me more about you than I needed to know. It’s clear you haven’t a thinking man’s dignity, but have you no shame as well, Mr. Nichols?
You would trumpet King Bloomberg’s legislating morality as genuine concern for easy health choices and suggest his corporate pals are unhappy with him while ignoring the devastating consequences his industry (more responsible for climate change than any other human factor), the “savvy businessmen” he summers with and the “personal army” which protects them, has wrought upon humanity on a global scale – all for the sake of re-electing a war criminal. Bloomberg’s litany of Obama’s successes, which you’ve so eagerly reprinted here, is an abomination, a strike against truth itself.
It’s clear that Sandy didn’t get rid of all the rats in your crumbling metropolis and I sincerely hope you enjoy your new life there, together with your brethren rodents: spoils you have richly earned through cowardice, hypocrisy and feckless psychopathology. Some would call it the American way.
And my choice to leave the scene of the crime after 30 years in Manhattan has never been more affirmed.
That Obama will be re-elected and never be held accountable for the massive damage he inflicted on us all does not change the history you anxiously wish to re-write. You’ll have your pyrrhic victory, you’ll retain your access to the despoilers and the comfortable little life they provide to cushion you from the real storm. But in the end, you’ll be dead and the truth from which you gleefully hide will be your epitaph.”
(http://www.thenation.com/blog/170960/bloomberg-backs-obama-precisely-right-reason)
I suspect that neither Nichols nor The Nation’s mostly milquetoast editorial board will even read it and if they do, they’d never stoop so low as to respond to a verbose whinger like me.
There’s the rub…
For those who feel that Nader cost Gore the 2000 election, and therefore allowed the Iraq War etc; it was actually lame,spineless Democrats in congress at the time, that jumped on the BS war-wagon so they wouldn’t appear weak, or even worse, the “P” word. They voted for the Iraq War Resolution. Colin Powell helped sell that war, and now he’s highly regarded by Democrats for his endorsement of Obama. Sick much?
The growth of Third Parties is essential to counter the corporate led & fed parties of greed and war, Democrats & Republicans. The votes for third parties must happen for them to grow visibly, and influence future voters/elections. It will take time; but voting for Obama now is only validating a mistake (although not mine,I voted for Nader 2008) and postponing the integration of higher-value politicians.
I voted for George McGovern in 1972, a true “liberal”. Aside from his magnificient oratory, Obama is much closer politically to the Republican Nixon.My vote for Jill Stein is not wasted. It will add to the growing millions who have had-enough of rightward-marching Democrats choosing to NOT honor their values.
this is a test
aha.. I just spent a lot of time crafting a germane comment to this great essay by K.G. and both attempts at submitting it failed, yet the above “this is a test” posted immediately. What’s up with that?
Guess I’ll try again
Throughout all of these debates, it has struck me that the terms ‘progressive’ and ‘liberal’ typically, though not exclusively, now describe political philosophies with strong sympathies for the rule of law. I would have thought that a ‘conservative’ value.
Words and strange times.
Anyway, as everyone knows, we are up against the wall at several fronts, too many with planet-wide consequences. Personally, I haven’t seen a credible argument anywhere that supports a vote for either of the two major party customer service reps- in either a moral or strategic sense, for those inclined to that political dualism,
as I was for stupid long decades.
Hey pillbilly @75 ,we share the same history .I would add that what cost Goe in Florida was over 250k of registered dems e.g. Chris Matthews ilk ,voted for Bush ,not to mention that Gore couldn’t carry his own state .I only mention it because tribal dems are so much like the birthers ,insofar as both believe what they need to believe regardless of the facts.
Point well taken p654 .from now now on I will define myself as a socialist ,which was the same a progressive until the liberals ”hide” from their tag when everyone clowned them for being wimps .Obviously I don’t believe in law-abiding change ,which is some pansy-ass liberal construct .I do still hope that peaceful forms of mass civil disobedience can do the job ,but I wouldn’t bet a dime in that outcome ,if only because the demopublicans are likely to define peaceful dissent as terrorism touts suite .Same goes for illegal drug activity .
Obama is the best republican running. The election is between a Rockefeller republican vs. a hard right Bush Jr./Reagan republican.
Right wingers and solid Democrats share a common illusion about Obama–that he is a liberal.
About Nader. McDonnell is full of self serving Dem party bullshit. In 2000 the Gore loss was spoken in terms of voter suppression, a corrupt Supreme Court, ballot construction, yuppie riots stopping the counting of votes, etc.
In 2012 the loss is all about Nader for Dem party apologists like O’Donnell. For the last 12 years Dem party elites marginalized Nader for the simple fact that he represented an alternative to an increasing right moving party and subserviance to monied interests. Nader was a leftist insurgency movement and he had to be stopped by Dems. Fast forward to last year, and the worst police violence against OWS was in cities controlled by Dems. OWS in many ways was a leftist insurgency. And it too had to be marginalized and beaten down.
During these last 12 years, Dem party leaders and activists did nothing about fixing the election systems. They had their narrative about the loss, and it wasn’t about voter suppression, which is why dem leadership was blind sided by gop creating legalized forms of Jim Crow.
You want change, then vote for change.
“You want change, then vote for change.”
Interesting idea.
Great piece. You should get Zinn’s name in at the top.
That is not true. Many, many non-voters do not vote because they prefer “none of the above,” which is a legitimate choice. Since the Amerikan system does not allow a checkbox for “none of the above,” then the only way to register your choice is to not vote at all.
I have not voted since I last wrote in my own name for all the candidates in an election and was told that if there were so few write-in votes then those votes would be discarded – and they were. Nice.
Non-voting is legitimate and should be taken seriously since us non-voters are the majority. Think about it.
Good catch. That was a kind of typo on my part.
I actually think O’Donnell knows Nader is not really responsible for Gore losing. I also thinking he was sincere when he covered third party politics in this segment. And here’s why.
And he used the Green Party’s logo or what I might call their brand during his recent campaign for the US Senate.
Look at this campaign photo. He is wearing a Green T-shirt. His signs have big sunflowers on them, like the Greens. But he ran as a Democrat.
Fair request. I’ll consider.
The spam filter was getting in the way of people who were trying to post comments. I went in and cleared multiple comments so they now appear in this thread (including bigchin’s long comment).
Is that general comment directed at me or anyone particular? Because I write what I write with the utmost respect for our nation’s electoral process. I’m so respectful of it that I believe people should vote how they would like to vote and ignore this talk about strategic voting.
Kevin, you open and close this critique of strategic voting with quotes from Howard Zinn yet never explicitly address his position on strategic voting. Yet this is easily ascertained. 2004:
2008 (essay in The Progressive):
I am sorry to inform you that the executive committee of “Fucking Retards” for Barry has put your membership on indefinite suspension status. You may appeal this decision to our chairperson, the dishonorable Mayor of Chicago.
That is true. I could have included it. I knew his position on strategic voting was similar to Ellsberg’s when he was alive. It doesn’t change the argument.
Appreciate the response.
As I said above, it’s a lot easier for me to vote for Stein in Wisconsin, if I think there’s at least some buffer between where we are today and a Weimar moment.
EW, gg, ys for starters!
Given the performance of the democrats when they had the HOR by almost 40 votes, the presidency, and 59 senators for two years, I would say absolutely nothing would have changed. Democrats will always say those mean minority republicans were picking on me. Bush, in contrast, with a minority in both houses of congress, did whatever the hell he wanted to. There are very few good things about Bush, but he never whined about the minority democrats picking on him.
EW’s backing Obama.
It’s interesting that you wrote this, because an electoral example within living memory is the candidacy of H. Ross Perot in 1992. Although eh did not secure enough electoral college votes to win, he gained enough of the popular vote that the deeply conservative Bill Clinton — he who ended Welfare, repealed numerous regulations, passed NAFTA, and laid the groundwork for the gutting of Social Security and Medicare that Obama has run with — felt politically empowered to implement all these policies and more. Had there been a comparable third party challenge from the left, akin to Perot’s nearly 19% in 1992, things might have gone very differently.
That is actually what happened in 2004 when John Kerry was the Democrats’ candidate against George W. Bush. We threw away our votes on Kerry and he was emboldened to ignore our concerns, running a weak campaign that allowed his ostensible opponent to define him. Then, even with undeniable evidence of massive electoral fraud on the part of the Bush-Cheney campaign — J. Kenneth Blackwell was the campaign co-chair in Ohio even as he was state secretary, in charge of running the election — Kerry chose not to defend his victory and conceded without a fight. Even Al Gore was willing to fight it out in court, though his lawyers pursued a disastrously incompetent legal argument.
So we see the failure of relegating our votes for third party candidates to “safe” states where we have no impact. Do we now have the courage to dump the losing strategy and make Democrats fear us? Only time will tell. And we have very little time left.
FTW!
It is very easy to deceive one’s self when it comes to Democrats and the Supreme Court. Remember that when Obama put Sonya Sotomayor up for nomination there were legitimate concerns that her record reflected an anti-abortion slant.
http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/SoniaSotomayor/story?id=7699191&page=1#.UIjrl2l27R_
What’s more, Democrats in the Senate voted in overwhelming numbers to confirm the four worst judges now sitting on the bench: Scalia, Thomas, Roberts, and Alito. And this they did even though they had enough senators to launch successful filibusters. If the party were at all reliable in defending the Supreme Court from being stacked with ideologically conservative extremists, you might have a case. But it isn’t, and so you do not.
Regardless of your actual sentiment, your refusal to vote will be taken by the establishment as silent approval of their policies, just as in the same way voting for Obama no matter one’s feelings about him places a stamp of approval on his extremist policies. Your ballot doesn’t come with any telepathic device that beams your reasoning into the minds of the people who count the votes, or the pundits who interpret electoral outcomes no matter how suspect those outcomes are. This is why people who choose not to vote are wasting their ballots, and why people who vote for Obama even though they claim to be wholly at odds with his policies are throwing them in the proverbial trash.
Maybe you see no candidates worth voting for. That is a legitimate complaint and a reflection on the state of our rigged system. Or perhaps there is no “perfect candidate” who represents all of your views. In that case, you vote for the candidate who most closely matches them, thereby sending the establishment the message that these are the policies you want implemented and you will vote only for those who best reflect your desires. Politicians read poll numbers and they look at other parties’ platforms.